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K0BE82481Offline
Post Subject: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566436Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 06:43 AM PST
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Sorry it wouldn't let me past the web address or anything but I can copy and past the article if you want to know.... I got it from (isportsweb)


Here is a trade rumor that somewhat makes sense, I was reading it and the source is saying that he heard this Been talked about after Al horford went down, here it is Jeff Teauge+ Josh smith for Pau gasol, this kinda makes sense I'd even thro couple players and that trade exception, Atlanta needs a big guy, horfod went down so they dont have any bigs, him and horford and Joe would be a nice 3 sum, I just don't Know if it's possible, because this would kill 2 birds with one stone typa deal, I'd love it, but I don't think the hawks are that stupid, but if this was been offered I'll take it idk about you but it's a good deal for us... Razz


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Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566437Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 07:17 AM PST
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I don't understand how valid this could be..

But someone wise had once told me.. If you hear anything which is too good to be true then it is not true..!!

This one is too good to be true.

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K0BE82481Offline
Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566438Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 07:37 AM PST
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Yeah I don't either but I read it so I thought it was kinda interesting, it is 2 good to be true, but the fact that al is down makes it alil more entertaining, the trio of gasol al and Joe is actually not that bad, but you are giving up 2 starters for 1 old starter I just don't see it happening....
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Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566448Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 08:34 AM PST
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Does not make sense for the Hawks. Teague is budding with Hinrich injured and Smith is steadily putting up great numbers. The Hawks would have two PFs who are averse to playing Center and both Gasol and Horford have similar games as both tend to shoot mid-range jumpers.

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K0BE82481Offline
Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566449Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 08:41 AM PST
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Al is out 3-4 months that's why they would at least look at it if we can offer alil more, but yeah this would never happen but just the idea makes sense cuz he's out, and we need a PG teauge is very good along with Josh smith, and if some how get Howard Smile most athletic front court in the NBA hahah all that is just a dream, we probably had a better chance with odom+paul for Kyle lowry and scola or Josh and teauge I could see those happening, not anymore tho
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Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566452Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 09:23 AM PST
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this is a horrible trade for the lakers. we trade one of the best power forwards for an pg that hasnt proved anything and is inconsistent. teague is a scoring guard hes more lou williams than anything. he has good potential i get that but for a guard whose only value is scoring hes scored under seven points five times this season not to mention hes only had 5 games over six assists. as for josh smith, hes a tweener he cant shoot good enough to be a Sf and isnt big enough to play the 4. i just dont see how this makes us better now. if anything itll help us rebuild in the future with teague and bynum. but it wont help our perimter defence since teague isnt avery good defender even though he has good physical tools. and he cant really score at will since hes still getting used to the nba style of play(last year he was second among point guards in gettting his shot blocked at 10.5%) we might as well let darius morris play starter minutes if you guys think a young unproven guard is the answer.also the hawks have the worst roster in the nba. only horford and teague have any value whatsoever everyone else is either overpaid(joe johnson, marvin williams) or a washed up veteran(Tmac, stackhouse, radmonovic, etc) so im not sure we or any team would want to deal with them. anyways the hawks would need to offer a 1st rounder and throw in kirk hinrichs expiring contract for ron artests for this deal to even be good enough for us and we know theyr not going to do that. i just dont get why some of you undervalue gasol so much. when hes gone you guys will definetly miss him.
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Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566457Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 09:57 AM PST
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nope we'd have to do way better than that to give up Pau.
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Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566458Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 09:57 AM PST
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If we do get josh smith.. It will increase our chances even more gettin D12, cuz he wants to play wit Josh Smith, theyre good friends.Teague is an up and coming pg, hes above avg imo and a quick one too hed become our starter instantly. The thing is if we trade Pau to the Hawks, then it will ruin our chances gettin Deron... Unless he signs wit us via FA. If either Smith or Deron come to La, it will push D12 even further to demand a trade to come to us, Smith and Deron hav that attraction that D13 wants. Smith and Teague wud instantly make us more athletic... "Do it Mitch."
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Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566460Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 10:05 AM PST
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I saw how well Teague did in the playoff last year. I see how josh smith is a lot tougher than Pau, more athletic, he can hit an outside shot, he'll scrap for boards and you don't really have to run an offense through him. A 2 for one? I think this would be pretty even on both sides.

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Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566464Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 10:37 AM PST
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Love Smith. And let's be honest here. A lot of fans are getting frustrated with Pau. I just don't think the FO will make a move before knowing how the d12 saga will play out.

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Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566465Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 10:38 AM PST
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IMO, this would make sense. I just don't see it happening. This would also creates space for Bynum as Josh Smith is more of an outside forward.
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Post Subject: RE: Paul gasol for Jeff teauge and Josh smith???? Post ID: 566466Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 10:43 AM PST
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^^Pau has become an outside forward as well.......lol
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Die-Hard-Laker-DudeOffline
Post ID: 566472Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 11:41 AM PST
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trialsNtribulations wrote:
^^Pau has become an outside forward as well.......lol


no Pau has become a three point specialist.......lmao
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jsales41
Post ID: 566474Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 11:48 AM PST
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Nope giving up Pau gives up a chance to get Dwight. Also Smith doesnt seem like a very bright player. There's a reason why the Hawks have been loaded with talent and have gone no where. Why bring it to LA? Lakers need high IQ & character players.

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113Offline
Post ID: 566478Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 12:10 PM PST
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Hell no. and you want to throw in more pieces for them? Are you kidding? Pau is worth two josh smiths and teague. Theyd have to throw in stuff for us and even then I wouldnt do it

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Post ID: 566480Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 12:15 PM PST
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Gasol to ATL
Teague, Smith, 1st to NJ
D-Will to LA

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Post ID: 566481Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 12:17 PM PST
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jsales41 wrote:
Nope giving up Pau gives up a chance to get Dwight. Also Smith doesnt seem like a very bright player. There's a reason why the Hawks have been loaded with talent and have gone no where. Why bring it to LA? Lakers need high IQ & character players.


Smith might be thug looking but he is a good character player. ATL has gotten no where because they don't have that one leader they need to go deep. Joe is a great player but he's not a number 1 player. Gasol, Joe, Horford, and Hinrich is a good team and could go deep.

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Post ID: 566486Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 12:36 PM PST
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Quote:
It seems as though every rumor that comes out of the woodworks in the NBA these days starts with the Los Angeles Lakers. Whether it’s Dwight Howard or Chris Paul it is clear they are in the market for new players.

The most recent trade rumor that involves them is one I heard right after Al Horford’s injury. This proposed deal would send Pau Gasol to the Atlanta Hawks and the Lakers would receive point guard Jeff Teague and forward Josh Smith. Look, I understand trade rumors are just that-rumors, but some of these actually materialize into legitimate trade talks, and this one would be devastating for the Hawks.

Jeff Teague is a young point guard who is beginning to prove himself in the NBA. The Lakers need a player like this because Derek Fisher is old, and Darius Morris isn’t ready.

Josh Smith is an athletic freak who can score points in bunches, and in a variety of different ways. He’s widely been considered the best dunker in the NBA since being drafted, and is starting to come into his own as an all around player.

The Hawks would essentially be trading two young players that they haven’t been openly shopping all offseason for an aging center that the Lakers have been trying to get rid of for a few months now. This is the reason the Lakers and Yankees of this world have stayed good for so long, and it’s time another franchise realized that.

If this trade was the other way around I wouldn’t have as big of a problem with it. It would still be an unfair trade, but it would be a team out-smarting the Lakers which wouldn’t be a familiar story.

This is the perfect time for the Lakers to make a proposal like this considering the fact that the Hawks’ center Horford is likely out for 3-4 months. The Hawks need to understand that he will be healthy again and not do anything drastic like give up two good young players to a team that is only going to give you one aging one.

Right now, for this season, Smith is averaging more points per game than Gasol by himself at 16.8 and 16.4. If that alone was the trade it would be no big deal, but adding Teague’s 11.7 per game instantly puts it in L.A’s favor.

Both Teague and Smith are viable trade pieces, but if they are going to be packaged together the Hawks better have either Dwight Howard or Deron Williams to show for it, because even though Smith has always been underrated it should take a lot for the Hawks to part ways with both him and Teague.


http://isportsweb.com/2012/01/13/josh-s ... he-lakers/

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Post ID: 566491Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 12:59 PM PST
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I would do this trade.
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Post ID: 566498Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 01:15 PM PST
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HAWKS cant be that stupid..or can they
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Post ID: 566580Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 05:15 PM PST
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I agree with 113's post

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Post ID: 566590Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 05:26 PM PST
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Well i agree with smith + teague not equal talent to pau gasol. Josh Smith gives us toughness/athleticism/shotblocker/decent midrange. Teague gives the lakers scoring/speed/court vision/ toughness but can be inconsistent at times. At least this trade doesn't deal with a big for small. I still wouldn't trade pau. iF it was pau for deron, i would do it even though we have to lose our twin towers. Rumors are rumors. I don't expect anything til the allstar break.
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Post ID: 566602Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 05:46 PM PST
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HELL NO. Josh Smith is bad...

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Post ID: 566614Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 06:20 PM PST
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Too me in my opinion I'd take smith and teauge for Paul, what can Paul do better then smith anyways?? The guy is getting softer every game NO blocks for a 7 footer, he's taking all jump shoots, I love the guy but we need new energy on this team and Josh smith can do that we don't need an all star PG, who wouldn't take this line up ....PG teauge SG Kobe SF barns PF smith C Howard that would be the best defensive team in the NBA, most athletic/energy/ hungry/Fast team/ line up you could ever come up with, we are not a slow team or old team and athletic we can score whenever and our defense would be lock down, quickest team in the league..... This would completely change the lakers to been contenders for along time
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Post ID: 566617Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 06:34 PM PST
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Between McRoberts and Barnes, we have enough energy on this team. What we need bad is a quality PG.

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Post ID: 566624Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 06:41 PM PST
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Well we would be getting a nice young PG and PF for one guy who wouldn't do that trade??? I don't think we can d-Williams that's the guy everyone wants we will not get him ppl needa stop dreaming, we don't need super stars to win
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Post ID: 566626Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 06:43 PM PST
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I would actually really consider this trade. Smith is not a "Big" PF, but we really do not need a Big "PF" in todays game anymore. I think Smith is a solid basketball player, not equal in the overall talent of Pau, but still a really good player. He would bring some youth and athleticism to our team. Another aspect that Josh Smith would bring to our team would be some solid defense. I also really like Jeff Teague. This season he is coming out and proving doubters wrong. I really like the way he has been playing. 12.3 ppg, about 6 apg, 2.1 spg on 46% shooting from the field and 44% from the three. That would solve our PG problems, and I think Teague can be our PG of the future.

But honestly I would prefer to do this trade only if we can get Dwight Howard for Andrew Bynum + fillers + picks. Who knows if Orlando would do that, but if they do, then I'd definitely be cool with the Pau for Teague and Smith trade.

With both of those trades happening our lineup turns from a slow and old: Fisher / Kobe / Barnes / Pau / Bynum to a much younger, athletic, defense juggernaut: Teague / Kobe / Barnes / Smith / Dwight. That is a more complete starting lineup then we currently would have, in my opinion. BUT, if we can get a superstar PG in Deron Williams in exchange for Pau, I would still prefer that.

The main reason to do this trade is to get some youth back onto our team. We are very old and slow, and we still need to think about the future, as well as the present. But then again, who knows if this proposed trade is even legit? They generally never are. Haha. I guess we just have to wait and see what our Front Office does, if anything!
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Post ID: 566628Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 06:47 PM PST
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Lakers_4_Lyfe_BayBay wrote:
I would actually really consider this trade. Smith is not a "Big" PF, but we really do not need a Big "PF" in todays game anymore. I think Smith is a solid basketball player, not equal in the overall talent of Pau, but still a really good player. He would bring some youth and athleticism to our team. Another aspect that Josh Smith would bring to our team would be some solid defense. I also really like Jeff Teague. This season he is coming out and proving doubters wrong. I really like the way he has been playing. 12.3 ppg, about 6 apg, 2.1 spg on 46% shooting from the field and 44% from the three. That would solve our PG problems, and I think Teague can be our PG of the future.

But honestly I would prefer to do this trade only if we can get Dwight Howard for Andrew Bynum + fillers + picks. Who knows if Orlando would do that, but if they do, then I'd definitely be cool with the Pau for Teague and Smith trade.

With both of those trades happening our lineup turns from a slow and old: Fisher / Kobe / Barnes / Pau / Bynum to a much younger, athletic, defense juggernaut: Teague / Kobe / Barnes / Smith / Dwight. That is a more complete starting lineup then we currently would have, in my opinion. BUT, if we can get a superstar PG in Deron Williams in exchange for Pau, I would still prefer that.

The main reason to do this trade is to get some youth back onto our team. We are very old and slow, and we still need to think about the future, as well as the present. But then again, who knows if this proposed trade is even legit? They generally never are. Haha. I guess we just have to wait and see what our Front Office does, if anything!


Couldn't agree more

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Post ID: 566631Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 06:52 PM PST
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^^ I agree as well but if your the nets FO and gave up so much to get Williams, would u do a gasoft for Williams deal??? Or even if we involve the rockets who knows if they still wanna do it?? They are playing well, I just can't see is getting both Williams and Howard just can't too good, some team will come out and steal one or both away
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Post ID: 566634Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 06:57 PM PST
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i would just be a happy if we can get one of these two dwill and d12. after that we can build around them and be in contention in the next few years than trying to be depsarate just to get both of them.

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Post ID: 566637Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 07:00 PM PST
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i agree but i think by trading teague who will be playing the point for them? so maybe they want us to include Morris or goudelock.. but i think it will be Morris will be included.

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Post ID: 566638Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 07:00 PM PST
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K0BE82481 wrote:
Too me in my opinion I'd take smith and teauge for Paul, what can Paul do better then smith anyways?? The guy is getting softer every game NO blocks for a 7 footer, he's taking all jump shoots, I love the guy but we need new energy on this team and Josh smith can do that we don't need an all star PG, who wouldn't take this line up ....PG teauge SG Kobe SF barns PF smith C Howard that would be the best defensive team in the NBA, most athletic/energy/ hungry/Fast team/ line up you could ever come up with, we are not a slow team or old team and athletic we can score whenever and our defense would be lock down, quickest team in the league..... This would completely change the lakers to been contenders for along time


^^^dayum when u put it out there like that, its enticing (to me) than a mofo!!! lol
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Post ID: 566644Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 07:11 PM PST
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I think the Lakers should remain the way they are until close to trade deadline and see what happens until then. If we trade Pau now, then we will have less pieces to trade for Dwight or D.Will. With Josh Smith we will get more physical and better defensively but I still think that we don't need to rush.
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LakerDymes
Post ID: 566658Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 07:32 PM PST
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to be honest a trade i would rather do would be pau and artest to the 76rs for andre iguodala and jrue holliday. i dont think either team would do the trade but its better than teague and josh smith. holliday is already one of the best defensive pg's in the league and you know what your getting with iguodala, a streaky shooter whose a great athlete and can score off the dribble and create shots for himself and others , not to mention hes a top 5 defensive player. if i was the lakers id do this even if i have to add a 1st rounder.
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LobCity14Offline
Post ID: 566662Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 07:35 PM PST
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no way hawks give up there youth for an aging Gasol.

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Don't trade Bynum!
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nightrain42Offline
Post ID: 566701Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 08:41 PM PST
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No. Pipe dream. Not sure I'd want it anyway.

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MOY24LAKERS
Post ID: 567111Posted: Jan 16, 2012 - 11:23 PM PST
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Honestly the more I think about this, the more I like the trade. But maybe just maybe a better trade will pop out.
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LakerMan7Offline
Post ID: 567454Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 01:36 AM PST
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I don't understand.. Everyone is always harping on Gasol for not being tough and not playing defense but when there is a rumor about trading him for a tough and very good defender, you don't want to do it. Not only that, we would be getting an athletic point guard who can start now and in the future, which has clearly been stated by nearly everyone how bad of a need there is at the PG position.

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Post ID: 567519Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 08:30 AM PST
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LakerMan7 wrote:
I don't understand.. Everyone is always harping on Gasol for not being tough and not playing defense but when there is a rumor about trading him for a tough and very good defender, you don't want to do it. Not only that, we would be getting an athletic point guard who can start now and in the future, which has clearly been stated by nearly everyone how bad of a need there is at the PG position.

My thoughts exactly Lakerman! SMH
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dan_morales_jrOffline
Post ID: 567532Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 09:28 AM PST
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How about Andrew Bynum for John Wall and JaVale Mcgee
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MOY24LAKERS
Post ID: 567534Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 09:30 AM PST
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dan_morales_jr wrote:
How about Andrew Bynum for John Wall and JaVale Mcgee


That won't happen. Unless both request a trade/unhappiness with the current team.

Plus I don't like that trade. The only way I include Bynum in any trade, it will be to get Howard.
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K0BE82481Offline
Post ID: 567535Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 09:31 AM PST
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^ I agree but this is just a rumor, first of all I love gasol he helped us get 2 rings and 3 finals, second you can't expect to always make it far with the same damn line up, look at the spurs the big 3 they won in 2005 and 2007 after that they make the playoffs but nothing happens, same with the lakers they reached the top twice failed a third time, so now we are going to see that decline stage, we need changes to get back to the top this roster won't make it out of the first round depending on who we play, yes size matters, heat reached the top but failed, they didn't have any bigs, they didn't win cuz Lebron is not Kobe simple, but other then that we need to get younger and athletic, I'd take 2 all stars or potential all stars, smith and hinrick or Teague for gasol easy instead of d-Williams for gasol which will never happen, 2 for 1 position, and get Howard 4 Bynum, I'd even take scola Lowry for gasol and bynum 4 Howard still the same Smile win -win for us get a PG PF and Center Smile again I don't think any of those would happen but you get the point...
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Die-Hard-Laker-DudeOffline
Post ID: 567536Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 09:34 AM PST
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gotcha @KOBE82481.........make a lot of since to me
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K0BE82481Offline
Post ID: 567541Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 09:45 AM PST
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Thank you my friend Smile ^ if I'm wrong or misleading in any information this is a thread anyone is welcome to argue my opinion after all it's just what I think we should do... Just the thought of Howard smith barns Kobe and Teague or hinrick makes me wonder, BEST defensive team with mike browns system, we would shut every team down I mean 70s mostly or 80s every game, we would bring back old school defense like back in the day Smile no more easy **** we would be an amazing team to watch ...... Athletic freaks haha I just needa stop dreaming haha
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Die-Hard-Laker-DudeOffline
Post ID: 567542Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 09:51 AM PST
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I guess I'm a dreamer too, cuz I want the Lakers FO to make a quality move too. Don't wanna experience the After Shaq, Kobe era. After that @ss whooping Dallas put on us during the playoff, then the lockout bs......I was starving for some basketball.

Mitch, please don't let this ship sink without making the necessary adjustments. You have to fix this **** Mitch, Jim or who ever is calling the shots.........or our beloved Lakers will go down like the Titanic. Toilet monster


Last edited by Die-Hard-Laker-Dude on Jan 17, 2012 - 06:05 PM PST; edited 4 times in total
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K0BE82481Offline
Post ID: 567545Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 10:05 AM PST
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Yeah I know they need sonething asap, if cupcake thinks this team can win a championship he musta had some good Cali bud, it's all jim buss fault smh , lakers always figure **** out, but if the owners blocked the co3, why would they make any trade to the lakers? If they think it could help us, if we had cp3 now we would be only talking about Howard or maybe not even him, we cld be killing people with a deadly back court, I just hope something happens soon so I can rest, I'm still not over the odom or Paul thing yet it's just crazy how both happened
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Die-Hard-Laker-DudeOffline
Post ID: 567696Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 05:25 PM PST
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Dear Laker organization,

Please don't leave the Lakers team in this condition.......our lil Brothers (clipps) think they are the sh!t. All of a sudden, I'm seeing the other team memorabilia in LA. When did they get pride........SMH
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MAGICLAKEZOffline
Post ID: 567710Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 06:27 PM PST
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Die-Hard-Laker-Dude wrote:
Dear Laker organization,

Please don't leave the Lakers team in this condition.......our lil Brothers (clipps) think they are the sh!t. All of a sudden, I'm seeing the other team memorabilia in LA. When did they get pride........SMH


^^ clips are, and will always remain shyt.... It will always stink....the only other thing you will ever see on that team is bandwagons and children of a lesser God..... Anyways, wonder why you always keep comparing and bringing up clippers? You along with viktokain, londonlaker, Lobcity, mdub21, kobe82481, lakerdymes, mhf94, js46 etc etc.......

you guys always seem to be uber concerned and always appear, to be planning some kind of a funeral for the lakers?

I always see you guys(above mentioned) discussing ridiculous trade scenarios, wreaking of sarcasm and always reminding us how the clips are here to stay. ...'kind of 'Rubbing it in'

And I'm seeing this happening in all the other threads as well.... With the same 'star' caste involved

I don't know if it's just me, or other lakers here who are noticing this happening in a daily basis....
I sometimes wonder if you and the others mentioned above are......clips fans? Just looking to stir trouble in a laker forum....

And yeah you guys always seem to be engaged b/w yourselves..... And the weirdest part, all the guys I just mentioned, sound alike and seem to be singing the tunes in all the threads

I wonder if it is just me, who has noticed this or if there are other concerned laker fans who have also noticed this.....
Maybe this is a conspiracy theory..maybe not... We will never know.

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Last edited by MAGICLAKEZ on Jan 17, 2012 - 06:42 PM PST; edited 1 time in total
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MAGICLAKEZOffline
Post ID: 567711Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 06:30 PM PST
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
Die-Hard-Laker-Dude wrote:
Dear Laker organization,

Please don't leave the Lakers team in this condition.......our lil Brothers (clipps) think they are the sh!t. All of a sudden, I'm seeing the other team memorabilia in LA. When did they get pride........SMH


wow


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Die-Hard-Laker-DudeOffline
Post ID: 567720Posted: Jan 17, 2012 - 06:44 PM PST
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MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
MAGICLAKEZ wrote:
Die-Hard-Laker-Dude wrote:
Dear Laker organization,

Please don't leave the Lakers team in this condition.......our lil Brothers (clipps) think they are the sh!t. All of a sudden, I'm seeing the other team memorabilia in LA. When did they get pride........SMH


wow



not me bruh.......never ever hear me holler Clippers nothing......Die hard Laker fan........Dad a season ticket holder. NOPE wrong guy. and yes I bring up trade ideals often because I love the Lakers, I'm a greedy Laker fan, and I want another championship.

One thing you won't see from me is going back n forth arguing on the internet. NOPE.


Last edited by Die-Hard-Laker-Dude on Jan 17, 2012 - 06:50 PM PST; edited 1 time in total
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