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magic42157
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Post subject: Would you roll the dice?
 Posted: Jul 19, 2008 - 10:47 PM PST
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Topbuzz Newbie
Joined: Feb 14, 2008
Posts: 7
  
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First of all let me say that I hve been a laker fan for about 28 years and am a big Kobe fan as well. I just wanted to see what your opinions would be.
After this upcoming season, our team salary is going to be at about 60 million with Lamar and Mihm coming off the books. (I looked on HoopsHype and it has us at about 55 million but does not include Sasha or others who may be signed over the summer.) This 60 million takes into account Kobe's 23 million. IF he opts out that would takes us down to 37 million.
The salary cap this coming year is 58.68 million with the tax cap at 71.15 million. This is an increase of about 3 million over last year for each. In a year or two it will be over 60 million and the tax cap over 75 million.
Knowing this information, would you roll the dice and let Kobe walk and try to make a play for LeBron the next year?
I know we have to extend Bynum and Ariza, but I think we would still have enough cap room for max contract and maybe some other pieces.
I have heard about LBJ going to Brooklyn, but I can't believe that he would want to play with Vince when he could pair up with Bynum.
Thank you for your time and responses.
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ReliveThe3PEAT
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Post subject: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 19, 2008 - 11:01 PM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Jul 19, 2008 Age: 17
Posts: 4346
votes: 22
Status: Offline
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NEVER...
LeBron depends too much on layups and dunks.
Kobe is a better overall player. |
_________________
Ask not what your teammates can do for you. Ask what you can do for your teammates.
-Magic Johnson
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VujacicSlovenia
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Post subject: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 19, 2008 - 11:08 PM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Jun 12, 2008
Posts: 3079
votes: 24
Status: Offline
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No. Not because LeBron isn't better than Kobe. He's already better than Kobe, and in two years it won't even be a contest. But because it's too risky - they may end up with nothing.
Oh, and I don't believe that it's the Lakers' call as to whether Kobe leaves. I think he has the player option... |
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"It doesn't matter who gets what. It's just a matter of doing what it takes to win." - Pau Gasol
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KOBEBRYANT24MVP
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Post subject: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 19, 2008 - 11:10 PM PST
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Casual Laker Fan
Joined: Jul 11, 2008
Posts: 53
Status: Offline
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| NO!!!! NEVER!!!!!!!!! KOBE MUST BE A LAKER FOREVER!!!!! |
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tyler
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Post subject: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 19, 2008 - 11:14 PM PST
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Big-Time Laker Fan
Joined: Jun 13, 2008
Posts: 825
votes: 1
Status: Offline
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| You dont let Kobe walk after his performance this year. That is slapping him in the face. But it is a player option. |
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Harry
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Post subject: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 12:43 AM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Aug 07, 2006
Posts: 2980
votes: 13
Status: Offline
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VujacicSlovenia wrote:
No. Not because LeBron isn't better than Kobe. He's already better than Kobe, and in two years it won't even be a contest. But because it's too risky - they may end up with nothing.
Oh, and I don't believe that it's the Lakers' call as to whether Kobe leaves. I think he has the player option...
Lebron is not better than Kobe. at least not yet. As much as i'm a Kobe and Laker fan, i know when i'm being biased and this isn't that situation. Lebron has the talent to be better, but until he develops a consistent jumper, and a killer instinct on both ends of the floor (as mentioned by many sports analysts), he won't be considered better than Kobe. They're both the best rebounders for their size and position, and both are excellent passers. If you're gonna bring in stats, don't forget the ball goes through Lebron's hands EVERY SINGLE time down the floor. You can argue with me, but this is what an experienced NBA vet will also tell you. |
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Tempy
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Post subject: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 12:43 AM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Jul 12, 2008
Posts: 2703
Location: El Pueblo de la Reina de Los Angeles
votes: 4
Status: Offline
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| How is lebron better than kobe, v the celtics kobe played way better than what lebron did. Lebron really needs to develop his jump shot then he can be classed as being better than kobe |
Last edited by Tempy on Jul 20, 2008 - 12:55 AM PST; edited 1 time in total
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tyler
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Post subject: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 12:52 AM PST
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Big-Time Laker Fan
Joined: Jun 13, 2008
Posts: 825
votes: 1
Status: Offline
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| how many times did van gundy say kobe is the best player in this world/on this planet???? |
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VujacicSlovenia
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Post subject: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 01:35 AM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Jun 12, 2008
Posts: 3079
votes: 24
Status: Offline
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Tempy wrote:
How is lebron better than kobe, v the celtics kobe played way better than what lebron did. Lebron really needs to develop his jump shot then he can be classed as being better than kobe
LeBron averaged 30.5 ppg in his Celtics series as opposed to Kobe's 25.7.
The assists and rebounds were also heavily in James' favor. |
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VujacicSlovenia
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Post subject: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 01:44 AM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Jun 12, 2008
Posts: 3079
votes: 24
Status: Offline
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Harry wrote:
VujacicSlovenia wrote:
No. Not because LeBron isn't better than Kobe. He's already better than Kobe, and in two years it won't even be a contest. But because it's too risky - they may end up with nothing.
Oh, and I don't believe that it's the Lakers' call as to whether Kobe leaves. I think he has the player option...
Lebron is not better than Kobe. at least not yet. As much as i'm a Kobe and Laker fan, i know when i'm being biased and this isn't that situation. Lebron has the talent to be better, but until he develops a consistent jumper, and a killer instinct on both ends of the floor (as mentioned by many sports analysts), he won't be considered better than Kobe. They're both the best rebounders for their size and position, and both are excellent passers. If you're gonna bring in stats, don't forget the ball goes through Lebron's hands EVERY SINGLE time down the floor. You can argue with me, but this is what an experienced NBA vet will also tell you.
Phil Jackson himself has said that Kobe Bryant is extremely over-rated as a defender. LeBron frequently guards the opponent's best perimeter player as well. I wouldn't say that Bryant is the best rebounding shooting guard either. The most appalling comment I found was "both are excellent passers." C'mon. Bryant is a good passer, no doubt, but James is arguably the best passer in the league! That's area isn't even close, in my estimation.
I'm not going to hold the fact that LeBron touches the ball frequently against him.
Yes, his jump shot is quite unreliable, but he has shown the ability to make clutch jumpers before. LeBron can also get to the basket with ease. When Bryant's jumper is off, he has no real outlet to go to.
I don't know any NBA veterans... |
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Tempy
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Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 01:48 AM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Jul 12, 2008
Posts: 2703
Location: El Pueblo de la Reina de Los Angeles
votes: 4
Status: Offline
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Harry
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Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 01:49 AM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Aug 07, 2006
Posts: 2980
votes: 13
Status: Offline
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| actually Kobe is the best guard rebounder in the NBA. check John Hollingers rankings. Kobe has i believe 3 highlights in passes and teamwork plays of the year and his passing is the most underrated part of his game, not according to me, but according to Stu Lantz and Charles Barkley. Also according to hollinger, if Kobe had the same number of possessions as Lebron, their assist numbers would be VERY similar. |
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Tempy
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Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 01:52 AM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Jul 12, 2008
Posts: 2703
Location: El Pueblo de la Reina de Los Angeles
votes: 4
Status: Offline
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and as for your comment about when kobes jumper aint working for him, 2007-08 Postseason FREE THROWS LEADERS: Free Throws Att. Per Game - All Teams
Displaying results 1-50 of 202 found
Results: 1-50 51-100 101-150 151-200 201-202 Next »
AVERAGE TOTAL
PLAYER NAME, TEAM NAME GP PPG FTM FTA FTM FTA FT%
1 LeBron James , CLE 13 28.2 9.4 12.8 122 167 .731
2 Shaquille O'Neal , PHX 5 15.2 6.4 12.8 32 64 .500
3 Dirk Nowitzki , DAL 5 26.8 8.4 10.4 42 52 .808
4 Kobe Bryant , LAL 21 30.1 7.5 9.2 157 194 .809
you telling me he gets that many fouls by trying to make jumpers? He takes it to the hole |
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Nay511 wrote:
Optimistic7292, with that name u are not optimistic.
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Harry
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Post subject: Re: RE: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 01:56 AM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Aug 07, 2006
Posts: 2980
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Status: Offline
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Harry wrote:
actually Kobe is the best guard rebounder in the NBA. check John Hollingers rankings. Kobe has i believe 3 highlights in passes and teamwork plays of the year and his passing is the most underrated part of his game, not according to me, but according to Stu Lantz and Charles Barkley. Also according to hollinger, if Kobe had the same number of possessions as Lebron, their assist numbers would be VERY similar.
Kobe has the #1 assist of the year and #1 teamwork play of the year. Not Nash, not anyone else. go watch yourself top 10 teamwork plays of the year and top 10 assists of the year.
The pass Kobe gave over his head to Luke on the other side of the floor that led to a Lamar dunk was a pass no other player would dare attempt. but thats just one example. like i said, go see for yourself. |
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cuckooroller
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Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 03:48 AM PST
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Die-Hard Laker Fan
Joined: Mar 27, 2008 Age: 58
Posts: 2302
Location: Italy
votes: 22
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Here we go again trying to compare a Guard to a Forward.
Kobe is a great defender, the problem is that he does not play defense as Michael Jordan did. Michael Jordan was always in a top defensive mode while Kobe only selectively turns on the defensive mode. Another difference is that Jordan lucked out on the general defensive prowess of the Chicago team. There were a number of good if not great defensive players that surrounded him so not only was the Chicago team a great collective defensive unit, but they also had several lock-down defenders. In Kobe's case - he pretty much is alone in being a defensive player on this unit - at least, as it was configured for most of last year (with little play by Ariza, or by Bynum). |
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Steve
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nightrain42
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Post subject: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 05:15 AM PST
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Serious Laker Fan
Joined: Feb 14, 2008
Posts: 476
Location: texas
votes: 1
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VujacicSlovenia wrote:
Tempy wrote:
How is lebron better than kobe, v the celtics kobe played way better than what lebron did. Lebron really needs to develop his jump shot then he can be classed as being better than kobe
LeBron averaged 30.5 ppg in his Celtics series as opposed to Kobe's 25.7.
The assists and rebounds were also heavily in James' favor.
Stupid question, dumber response. The Celt's could allow James to score, they ain't got no one else. Who else on that team could score or create his own shot? With Cleveland it's let James score and stop everyone else. With us, it's stop Kobe and see IF anyone else can score, which didn't happen. I take Kobe over LeBron any day... |
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CAZ_LAKERFAN_KOBEFAN
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Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 07:29 AM PST
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Laker GM
Joined: Oct 27, 2007 Age: 20
Posts: 4575
votes: 4
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Kobe passing game is underrated.
Lebron has better numbers because, every single play, every fast break goes through Lebron hands.
Kobe is Mr.do-it-all, Lebron can´t do it all, LeBron is good because his great athleticism.
1)Lebron can´t post up.
2)Lebron still hasn´t fully developed a stop jumpshot, I mean he can´t dribble-stop-shoot, he shoots the ball right away or takes it all the way to the hole.
3)Lets say this...
Kobe-Athleticism= still a solid all around player, who can do it all.
Lebron-Athleticism=?????
90% of lebron game is because his incredible athleticism.... not the same case with Kobe...
Right now kobe is the better all around player, I don´t know in 4 years, but right now, Kobe is better. |
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The Sky is the limit.
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gemfow
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Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Would you roll the dice?
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 09:25 AM PST
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Die-Hard Laker Fan
Joined: Jul 12, 2007
Posts: 2290
Location: Maryland
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We totally took it from would you roll the dice to who is better. I'll give my take on both:
Not only no, but hell no I wouldn't roll the dice on something ludicrous like trying to get Lebron. That's like me being married to Roselyn Sanchez and I find out Jessica Biel is coming to town to do a poster signing and I decide to focus on her because I might have a chance at her, like all the other people headed down there.
It's interesting how some folks see a person come up with great stats and automatically try to annoint him better. Look at things from another angle besides numbers mr. Slovenia. Cleveland is a really good defensive team who gets turnovers, forces bad shots, etc... What happens when you get turnovers? You get easy buckets with turnovers and bad shots and Lebron gets a lot of easy layups and dunks due to what I just mentioned. I'm not saying Lebron can't score in the half court but he doesn't have to do it consistently. When you look at Kobe a lot of his scoring comes with isolations, great foot work with his post game and very few easy layups, dunks and lobs because the Lakers don't have the defense of a Cleveland squad.
Let's move on to assists, I would say Lebron has a slight edge in that department but not to the point of you saying arguably the best passer in the league, apparently you'e the only one arguing that. Lebron should have more assists because he basically plays thepoint and is isolated at the top of the three point line a lot of times, they set screens to free him up and once he gets a head of steam it's over so when the help comes he finds the open men with ease. Passing is a very underrated part of Kobe's game, this guy throws some nice dimes and it's been more apparent since the media hasn't slammed him as much for his shooting 30 shots a game. Now he has guys who can catch and finish. It's funny how soon people forget that Kobe was the facilitator of the triangle during the championship years and how he got Shaq so many buckets off of his drives and great assists, people have short memories.
Kobe is a really good rebounder for the 2 guard position, Lebron is a good rebounder also, but let's not forget that Lebron is 6'8" 250-255 compared to Kobe's 6'6" 200-215. Also, have you noticed when an opposing team against Cleveland shoots free throws that sometimes Lebron is placed in a big position on the paint? guess what happens with a missed free throw, yep he gets that rebound also.
As far as defense is concerned, Lebron is not an ole` defender but he isn't in Kobe's class. I don't know of one player in thie league who has to consistently be everything on offense and everything on defense and thrive at both for a whole game. MJ was great at both, but Pippen guarded all the great perimter players and MJ got to roam. MJ would guard the top tier guys when he requested, but it wasn't as if he had to guard them consistently. That's where Kobe has never had that luxury. When Shaq was in LA Kobe was a terror defensively because he didn't have to be everything on offense he could lock in defensively and Shaq was the man on offense. Plus he was younger then also, which definitely helps when moving laterally which Lebron isn't all that good, but that's mostly due to his size, you can't expect a 250 pound man to consistently check 2 guards and small forwards all the time when he has a pf body.
I think I've written enough, VujacicSlovenia, look at more than just numbers , analyze things from different angles, it's about more than just stats that make a player. Hollinger is terrible in my opinion with his stats lookups and trying to get a new stat added with the whole per crap. Lebron's game elevated last year and I think that has something to do with Kobe and being around him last Summer and the same thing will happen this Summer. Has anyone noticed how Mike Miller and Michael Redd's defense has gone up since working defensive drills with Kobe? Plus everyone seemed to forgot tha tKobe has a damaged pinky that required surgery and he still put up MVP numbers, he was still the focal point and that says a lot about this Laker great. |
_________________
"It made me feel like I should throw mine away." - Larry Bird, upon hearing that Kobe hadn't earned the MVP trophy until this year.
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flambergex69
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Post subject:
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 09:44 AM PST
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Die-Hard Laker Fan
Joined: Jul 18, 2008 Age: 35
Posts: 2316
votes: 12
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| First of all, why would anyone compare kobe who is a natural sg and almost 30 years old with lebron who is a natural sf and only 24? If kobe wants to leave then that's the only time we let him go. If he stays, im sure he knows the proper time for him to retire so that the team can rebuild. He is, in my opinion, the greatest player after michael jordan. You don't suggest letting someone like that walk away. |
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bfbeck
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Post subject:
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 11:15 AM PST
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Casual Laker Fan
Joined: Jun 26, 2008 Age: 26
Posts: 111
Location: Little Rock
Status: Offline
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| no. that would be silly. |
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myspace.com/bfbeck
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tyler
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Post subject:
Posted: Jul 20, 2008 - 01:20 PM PST
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Big-Time Laker Fan
Joined: Jun 13, 2008
Posts: 825
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