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    trublulakerOffline
    Post subject: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 06, 2008 - 10:06 PM PST
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    Pau isn't the force Shaq was ... but he might fit better

    Debate-provoking basketball evaluations always lead to the unleashing of numbers to initiate or advance an argument on behalf of a particular point of view.

    The opening numbers for this playoff-relevant, two-on-two comparison are 5 and 3. The 5 represents the number of Los Angeles Lakers playoff games (all victories) featuring Kobe Bryant and Pau Gasol on the same team. The 3 represents the number of championship rings the Lakers were able to seize while Kobe and Shaquille O'Neal were both on the payroll.

    This demonstrates that while the Lakers' current 1-2 jackhammer looms as a formidable playoff partnership, it has miles to go before even sneaking up on the level of achievement recorded by the former 1-2 punch.

    OK, before counting the ways that Gasol seems to be smoothly tucked inside Phil Jackson's triangle-offense machine, let's pay our respects to Shaq.

    O'Neal, who was 28 years old (Pau will be 28 in July) when the Lakers began their three-peat in 2000, will leave the NBA as one of the most dominant physical forces in league history. Gasol will never inspire cold sweats from opposing coaches, scouts, players and fans as Shaq did during his halcyon days.

    But within the flow-inducing properties of the triangle (and in pick-and-roll defense) Gasol offers certain upgrades that O'Neal would have been unable (or unwilling) to match.

    Before going into strategic detail, let's clear the psychological air. It's rather obvious that Gasol's serenity regarding his role as second fiddle to Bryant is a major reason why his arrival from Memphis has been relatively seamless.

    We also acknowledge that Shaq realized (too late) that acquiescing to the superstar efforts of a flashy young guard is not a bad way to score another O'Brien trophy. After fighting this notion (and Kobe) in L.A., O'Neal was able to reach another parade by becoming backup singer for Dwyane Wade.

    Anyway, with those qualifiers offered to the basketball gods, we're now free to see how the Kobe-Pau marriage compares to Kobe-Shaq on the floor.

    Let's begin with Gasol's many fine in-game characteristics. At 7-feet and a Twizzler or two shy of 260 pounds, Paul lacks the mass and the Y2K-era explosion that enabled O'Neal to pound foes into submission. But Gasol's inside-outside versatility sets him apart from any 7-footer whose name springs to mind.

    He has excellent footwork and touch around the hoop. His ability to step outside and make shots is light years ahead of O'Neal's inability to do the same. While Shaq has been a fine passer, Gasol's awareness and commitment to delivering the ball on time and to the right spot is superior.

    Gasol is better at filling the lane in transition ... because he wants to. Young Shaq certainly had uncanny acceleration for a building with feet, but he rarely participated in a portion of the game that exploited Bryant's speed.

    Pau also has been ahead of O'Neal in reading the defense and diving to the rim for a timely pass, which may be an unfair comparison because Shaq wouldn't stray far enough from the basket to require a dive.

    It also should be noted that Gasol is shooting 73 percent from the free-throw line.

    With Gasol on the floor, the Lakers have an easier time working Kobe on the low post within the triangle alignment. Bryant, a match-up nightmare with his back to the basket, has more room to operate because Pau can start on the weak side block and open the basket area for Kobe by flashing to the high post. Gasol's ability to make a 15-footer requires a post defender to stay close to the free-throw line rather than help down low on Kobe.


    While operating on the low post, Gasol facilitates better ball movement due to his ability to recognize a scoring advantage and quickly go to it without using a couple of dribbles and a lowered shoulder; if the move isn't there at once (usually due to a help defender), Pau will make the immediate pass. Shaq had similar diagnostic abilities and passing talent, but a greater interest in being the man meant that his pass out of a double team usually went to the teammate with an opportunity to give it back to him on the re-post.

    In screen-roll offense, Gasol is a pick-and-pop option that O'Neal could only dream of being. His refusal to claim gravy as a food group enabled Pau to offer more agility at rolling to the basket after the screen, catching a pass and using balance and finesse to finish.

    Although the Lakers' spacing and ball movement upgrades are obvious this season, it should be noted that the Kobe-Pau supporting cast is blessed by having greater depth of shooters and more skilled passers.

    Moving to defense, we surrender to the memory that — at 7-1 and a few peanuts over 330 pounds — O'Neal was a more terrifying obstacle near the basket. However, Gasol's current average of 2.6 blocks per game is right there with Shaq's swatt-age during the Laker title years.

    Defending the pick-and-roll offers perhaps the greatest separation; O'Neal basically is content to hang 5-10 feet behind the screener (the player he's guarding) and allow the ballhandler to turn the corner for a cozy jumper. Depending on how Jackson decides to deploy his "bigs" in screen-roll defense, Gasol can provide enough agility and length to assume the proper angle in hedging the ballhandler and has the quickness to return to defending the screener.

    He's also capable, should the need arise, to participate in rotation schemes rather than just camp out under the basket.

    So, Gasol is the heroic addition from Memphis and Shaq was chopped liver, right? No, thinking that would be absurd. But for the moment, it just seems that — abetted by Bryant's on-court maturity and magnanimous overtures — Pau is a great fit at the perfect time. Never forget that during the Lakers' three-peat days, the NBA was more of a post-and-isolation league than it is right now.

    And we also should avoid any inadvertent notions that might suggest a minimization of the impact from the Bryant-O'Neal glory days. Three consecutive championships are nothing to sneeze at, especially when you're still sitting 11 victories away from a one-peat.

    http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/8109 ... amp;ATT=73

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    RandyPandy
    Post subject: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 06, 2008 - 10:33 PM PST
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    They really do bring different flavors into the team. Let us just say that the Lakers are lucky to have both of them in different times for us to contend for the chip.
     
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    trublulakerOffline
    Post subject: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 06, 2008 - 11:32 PM PST
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    Quote:

    They really do bring different flavors into the team. Let us just say that the Lakers are lucky to have both of them in different times for us to contend for the chip.


    I agree. But Pau still have to win a championship as a Laker to be mentioned in the same breath as Shaq..I agree though that Pau is such a perfect fit for the triangle and Kobe as well being an able big man with great passing skills. He is such a complete package that it would be a shame if he and kobe would not win a championship together with the lakers.

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    KobeIsGoodOffline
    Post subject: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 06, 2008 - 11:34 PM PST
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    Pau will never be the playoff force that Shaq was. This is a really weird article, they are such different players, it's hard to draw a legitmate comparision.
     
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    noname24Offline
    Post subject: Re: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 07, 2008 - 12:02 AM PST
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    KobeIsGood wrote:
    Pau will never be the playoff force that Shaq was. This is a really weird article, they are such different players, it's hard to draw a legitmate comparision.


    I agree. One relies on skills and one relies on force. Shaq was a good compliment to Kobe, but Pau is a greater fit in L.A.

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    LA_85Offline
    Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 07, 2008 - 12:45 AM PST
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    one brought 3 championships to LA.
    lets see what pau can do.
    i'm rooting for him to break that record Wink

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    Lakers4KobeOffline
    Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 07, 2008 - 05:21 AM PST
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    Pau will never compare to Shaq in his prime during the three peat. Gasol is such a different player to Shaq that it is really hard to compare them. Shaq was, as this article said, 330 pounds which meant nobody wanted to drive against him which was great for us. I can't really compare the two.

    Now Bynum on the other hand...

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    BaadMasterOffline
    Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 07, 2008 - 07:36 AM PST
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    I believe Kobe will get three, maybe four more Championships before he hangs 'em up. But, three IN A ROW is a whole other animal. Even the great Showtime Lakers never "three-peated." We have to show great respect to the Shaq-Kobe era -- and the power and presence of Shaq in particular. Those teams, along with the MJ Bulls, the "only two in a row" Showtime Lakers and the Bird-led Celtics were the best teams I ever saw.

    It does a disservice to the greatness of Shaq to compare his brute power based game to Pau's -- just as it is a disservice to Pau to compare his team-oriented game to Shaq's. That is a mano-a-mano comparison that is like comparing a Ferarri to a Porche. Both are great in their own way.

    But as to their respective teams...the new era Kobe-Pau tandem still has a long way to go to match three friggin' Championships in a row!.
     
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    CAZ_LAKERFAN_KOBEFANOffline
    Post subject:   PostPosted: May 07, 2008 - 08:59 AM PST
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    Gasol is great, very skilled player, but.....

    Shaq > Pau

    Shaq was a force.

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    clouduclaOffline
    Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 07, 2008 - 01:08 PM PST
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    shaq is a center, pau is a pf playing the center position.

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    CAZ_LAKERFAN_KOBEFANOffline
    Post subject: Re: RE: Re: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 07, 2008 - 04:55 PM PST
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    clouducla wrote:
    shaq is a center, pau is a pf playing the center position.


    good point.
    didn´t Pau play SF in his first year as a Grizzlies player?

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    OC_ShowtimeOffline
    Post subject: RE: Re: RE: Pau vs. Shaq Analysis  PostPosted: May 07, 2008 - 05:11 PM PST
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    Pau is a star in the league who is a consistent scorer, good passer, high basketball IQ. Shaq was a superstar in the league that teams had to adjust their entire defensive scheme around. I agree Pau fits better into the purity of the triangle offense. Shaq would often get the ball in the paint and bull his way to the basket. Shaq was a decent passer but the flow was not as smooth as it is now. I think the current Lakers are more fun to watch.

    Bynum is our future as far as dominant Laker centers that can totally take over a game. Gasol is a very talented PF and great teammate who can do many things on the court but he does not strike fear in opponents like Shaq did or Kobe does or Bynum will.
     
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    SPQROffline
    Post subject:   PostPosted: May 10, 2008 - 03:01 PM PST
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    Comparing Shaq and Pau is a joke. Pau is a nice offensive player who is severely limited in rebounding an defense. Shaq is one of the greatest Centers and players in NBA history. This guy put so much pressure on defenses he literally destroyed a teams ability to run the defenses they wanted to or were used to playing. He single handly obliterated game planning and strategy for opposing coachs and player. Isaih Thomas and Larry Bird and many other coaches and GM's commented on this back when Shaq was winning titles in LA- about what a completely distruptive force Shaq was not only on the court but in planning to play the Lakers and drawing up any kind of game plan against them.

    And after all this attempt to plan for him and somehow overcome his efficacy, he would regularly go out and get 35points and 15-22 boards. Comparing the posative effect of this great player against Pau is a like comparing a two hour rain storm with a three month long rainy season in the amazon.

    The young Shaq is not only a better fit with this team, but he's a better fit with any team, in any league, in any country in the history of basketball since the first game was played. No offense to Pau...but please, any comparison as to their respective effectiveness is a joke.

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    Last edited by SPQR on May 12, 2008 - 11:26 AM PST; edited 3 times in total
     
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    perrylittlesOffline
    Post subject:   PostPosted: May 11, 2008 - 03:58 AM PST
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    The team is improved and more fun to watch than the three peat version only if full roster could be healthy for at least handful of runs.

    Pau, Byno or Shaq at the low blocks. What you do with what you have matters more than what you do have or have nots... Let's do this!
     
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    yonglakerOffline
    Post subject:   PostPosted: May 11, 2008 - 05:00 AM PST
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    perrylittles wrote:
    The team is improved and more fun to watch than the three peat version only if full roster could be healthy for at least handful of runs.

    Pau, Byno or Shaq at the low blocks. What you do with what you have matters more than what you do have or have nots... Let's do this!


    I like pau better than shaq the whole team seems to run better and we dont have to worry about his FT's. Its his first year with the lakers so i will reserve who was better with the lakers once he is gone from the team. If he wins the title in his first year it will put him ahead of shaq in his first year as a laker since shaq didnt bring a title until his 3rd season. Lakers only lost 1 game over a month which is pretty impressive.
     
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    lakerchinoOffline
    Post subject:   PostPosted: May 11, 2008 - 07:23 AM PST
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    Pau is a 7 foot guard. LOL

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